Science Of Motion

Jean Luc Cornille group discussions on anything "horse"...dressage,jumpers, Science Of Motion in action.

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Latest Activity: May 8, 2013

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saddling 2 Replies

When there is an imbalance in the shoulders and a saddle that has BEEN sufficient quite suddenly becomes NOT comfortable for the horse right after a trigger point myotherapy session, what would you…Continue

Started by Margaret Kunz. Last reply by Margaret Kunz Dec 4, 2009.

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Comment by deb pawlyshyn on October 7, 2011 at 1:56pm

Thankyou I wish I could leave the farm and come to your clinics.I did visit your website. Will you be doing any DVD's of the clinic as I would definetly be interested in one or a current DVD of in hand work you already have done.Would it be alright to message you. I see you have done clinics in Alberta and Quebec that is promising. Perhaps one could set something up for B.C. where I live.In any event, a recommendation of one of your DVD's that currently explains your in hand technique is something I would be interested in.I can see this in hand work being a valuable tool for other applications such as teaching a horse to accept a rider on it's back and the prep work to make it a more understanding concept for the horse.I feel we are at a turn point in breeding horses. We have developed them to such a state that we need better ways to communicate our next steps to them.


Comment by deb pawlyshyn on October 6, 2011 at 2:00pm

I am enjoying your in hand photos, and was wondering about incorporating some of this training into a horse I am working on that has recently injured his front tendon. Was wondering how often you do this and for how long and what are some of the things you work on.Currently I have just gone back to the plow jockey method where I travel behind him all over the property.


Comment by deb pawlyshyn on September 15, 2011 at 10:40pm

thankyou it explains a lot actually , I also had the opportunity to read more of your site as well as see a couple of your videos. I found it interesting your video of the Bold ruler tb. My computer takes a while to load some of your riding videos and it is fasinating for me to see the horse's limbs suspended for a moment as the computer catches up.I found the Bold Ruler line especially close up, an interesting line of horse flesh so was very interested in how you rode your guy.I saw at the end the beautiful swing of the tail from behind and thought that it was quite lovely. I admit to having to read your work a few times to fully comphrehend and also to memorize and play back in my mind as I utilize this info for my horse's benifit and mine. I thank you for your time in responding to my request and was able to add another nugget about the cavaletti issue to my store of worthwhile info.

I enjoyed the recent pics of your grey and your recent article and thank you again it seemed timely your article and a benifit to me.


Comment by deb pawlyshyn on September 15, 2011 at 12:01am

Would it be possible to have a discussion on what exactly is trailing hocks. How does it look on the horse and is it possible to have horses that don't have a rider on their back"s trail their hocks? Or is this strickly a rider's syndrome or a rider related syndrome.Hoping to see pics if at all possible. My reasons for asking I will explain later as I think I have observed something but would need some more input and clarity on the subject. I believe it is not as cut and dried JMO. thanks in advance


thanks in advance.

Comment by Deborah Imershein on February 4, 2010 at 10:36pm
Hi, Jackie. I certainly agree that there are all sorts of people claiming to know what classical dressage is and say they are applying it. In fact, one will find that there was inconsistency in the opinions and training methods of those who rode in the "classical" period. There was also change in the beliefs and therefore the riding style of particular trainers (it was Baucher, I believe, who was the most notable for this) during their lifetime. So anyone who wants to say that they are following "classical" dressage ought to realize that. Even if we agree on a definition of what classical dressage is, I think it is important to note that some classical riders had the talent to work with the physiology of the horse and the horse's natural movement, but they did not have the benefit of the scientific knowledge that Jean Luc has, and does, rigorously study and apply. So, much of what is written in the old texts is not replicable. I suggest also that any system, no matter how good its rationale overall, that does not allow for the horse's individuality, especially in conformation, is potentially as harmful as it is useful.

Not only are most of the people calling themselves dressage riders ignorant of what science tells us about the horse's body (much less applying it), it is quite true that most horses are pushed into a frame and that training is rushed because it is focused on "results" rather than a true and pleasurable partnership. This is so much the norm that most people do not realize that is what they are doing.

The way to stop these abuses is to show people a better way. That is what Jean Luc is trying to do. Hopefully, by raising the money to document Manchester's recovery and by the interest of people like you who care about the welfare of the horse, the word will spread.
Comment by Jackie Cochran on February 4, 2010 at 9:45am
I write the following with trepidation, fearing abuse from dressage riders who literally worship the religion of their interpretation of "classical dressage". I apologize to all dressage riders and trainers who train properly and gradually if you feel insulted for some reason for what I say.

What I see is that the current dressage paradigm RUSHES the horse's physical development. It tries to combine fine physical control with the physical development of the horse from the beginning of training. When the rider insists that the horse attain and hold physical stances for which the horse just does not have the muscular strength or endurance, it causes resistances which become worse, and muscle strains, joint strains, etc.. Not only that, but often the horse has NO relief from the rider's seat, again from the beginning of training. This means that you have problems in the spine which complicate matters immensely.

If people would train future dressage horses in the Forward Riding method or the Ft. Riley method a lot of these problems could be avoided. Keeping the weight of the rider forward in the saddle, over the strongest part of the back, enables the horse to slowly build up muscle further down the spine BEFORE the rider's weight moves further back. Allowing the horlse to choose its own head/neck carraige enables it to learn how best to use its own body. The horse cannot learn this if its movement is constrained before its muscles are strong enough to cope with the restraint. Eventually (around two years by the Ft. Riley method) the horse develops enough physical strength, endurance and agility to move into collected work without risking the horse's soundness. The horse's back knows how to cope with the rider's weight, and the loin and neck muscles are strong enough to begin the more demanding work. The horse is READY for this advanced work.
Comment by Deborah Imershein on February 3, 2010 at 10:26pm
Susie, that is so very sad and how unfair for that poor horse.
I hope that the combined power of the videos and the ability of the word to spread over the Internet will finally provide the wide exposure Jean Luc's work—and all horses—deserve. To have such kind and noble animals suffer because we want to shape them to convention rather than honor their individual conformation and capabilities with true and educated partnership is cruel and uncivilized. I realize it isn't intended that way, but the first step is to be willing to wake up then learn then apply. If horses could somehow do to us what is done to them, they'd lock us up! Then again, they wouldn't, which is what makes all this even sadder.
Comment by SUSIE-SOLOMON-MABE on February 3, 2010 at 7:29pm
I have seen this type of suspensory dropping, on an arabian gelding who was used for ENDURANCE over the worst terrain one could ever imagine.
His pasterns were totally horizontal at the walk and he wore bandages to help keep his poor pasterns from bleeding.
Because of this he had changed his center of gravity into this hill- and was ever so back humpy, so he could get his hind legs down and up so fast and keep his weight on his back not on his haunches. He was in pain from every part of his verterbrea and his mind was always unhappy.
I was his stall care given back then and would put 4 bags of shavings in his stall every other day so he could lay down and feel for a while, that he did not have to cope with pain.
As he deteriated- his owners left him- they just stopped coming to the barn as was the way folks did it back then and then stopped paying board and answering our calls.
One day when the vet was there for another horse, he looked at this sad little arab and did the right thing- he let him go and gave him a a way to stop being in pain.
Comment by Deborah Imershein on February 2, 2010 at 11:37pm
If I had the finances, my current horse, Toastie, and I would have gone to Florida to train with Jean Luc years ago. Even from a tiny bit of video taken back then, Jean Luc could see Toastie's lameness in the RF (hidden to me at that time by the lameness LF) before it manifest.

A few of you may know of my first horse, Allure. He came to me at no cost because he had suspensory desmitis, otherwise known as "breaking down," which means his hind pasterns were parallel to the ground. Despite this dramatic condition and the recommendation of several vets to put him down, Jean Luc took Allure, studied him, and helped him learn how to use his body in a way that maintained his ability to move at all gaits and even to be ridden at all gaits.

Now, in hopes of making life better for many horses, Jean Luc intends to document the process of working with another horse who has no other chance. Manchester's story is unique only in that he is such a well bred animal and has clearly been given every chance money can buy—yet his "problem" persists. I encourage you to support this effort to save a magnificent animal. In the process, you will learn many things of value for the health of your own horse(s).
Comment by SUSIE-SOLOMON-MABE on January 28, 2010 at 2:16pm
well stated. Nicely and to the very point.

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